librelist archives

« back to archive

[WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

[WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Wceeeng 2011
Date:
2010-09-17 @ 17:49
<HTML xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META name=GENERATOR content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.18943"></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>* We apologize if you 
receive multiple copies of this CFP<BR></FONT><FONT 
size=3>==========================================================<BR>Congress
Announcement: Full Paper Submission Deadline (Dec. 31, 
2010)<BR>==========================================================<BR><BR>It
is our great pleasure to announce the <SPAN style="COLOR: red">2011 World 
Congress on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering (WCEEENG'11)</SPAN> to be held in <SPAN style="COLOR: 
red">Cairo, Egypt</SPAN>, <SPAN style="COLOR: red">4 - 7 January 
2011</SPAN>. The Congress is organized to invite international delegates, 
to share their latest research findings on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering. WCEEENG'11 is organized by INFOMESR.</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3>Papers on original works 
are solicited on a variety of topics, including but not limited to the 
following congress tracks:</FONT></P><FONT size=3>
<P><STRONG><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN></STRONG></P>
<UL>
<LI>Electrical Power 
<LI>Telecommunication 
<LI>Computer Science and Engineering 
<LI>Biotechnology 
<LI>Electronics 
<LI>Control Systems and Robotics 
<LI>Signal Processing 
<LI>Circuits and Systems 
<LI>Electromagnetics 
<LI>Electrical Materials 
<LI>Optoelctronics 
<LI>Mechatronics 
<LI>Student Session 
<LI>Other Related Fields</LI></UL></FONT>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3><B><I><U>Submission: 
<BR></U></I></B><BR>Please submit full papers to the Conference website 
address: </FONT><A 
href="http://infomesr.org/paper%20submission.html"><SPAN style="COLOR: 
black"><FONT 
size=3>infomesr.org/paper$20submission.html</FONT></SPAN></A><A 
href="http://edas.info/N8796" target=_blank></A><FONT 
size=3>.<BR><BR>Further information can be obtained from the following 
website:</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A 
href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences">domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences</A></FONT><A

href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences"><SPAN
style="COLOR: black"><FONT size=3></FONT></SPAN></A><FONT size=3> 
</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><o:p><FONT size=3> </FONT></o:p></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>Important Dates/Deadlines: 
Paper Submission Deadline: Dec. 31, 2010<BR><BR>kindly forward this email 
to other interested 
parties.<BR> <BR>Regards<BR>--------------------------------<BR>Conferences Rapporteur<BR>Tel. (002 - 010) 6896063<BR>Fax. (002 - 02) 24488366</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>* All replies must be directed to: </FONT><A
href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-ansi-language:
EN-US; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-language: 
EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">* To avoid spam, when reply, please, 
replace [AT] with @ and [dot] with 
.<BR>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-18 @ 06:52
Uhm… what? Also, looks like you forgot to set the content-type
appropriately.

On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 10:49 AM, WCEEENG 2011 <admin@infomesr.org> wrote:

> <HTML xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD>
> <META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv=Content-Type>
> <META name=GENERATOR content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.18943"></HEAD>
> <BODY>
> <DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>* We apologize if you
> receive multiple copies of this CFP<BR></FONT><FONT
> size=3>==========================================================<BR>Congress
> Announcement: Full Paper Submission Deadline (Dec. 31,
> 2010)<BR>==========================================================<BR><BR>It
> is our great pleasure to announce the <SPAN style="COLOR: red">2011 World
> Congress on Electronics and Electrical
> Engineering (WCEEENG'11)</SPAN> to be held in <SPAN style="COLOR:
> red">Cairo, Egypt</SPAN>, <SPAN style="COLOR: red">4 - 7 January
> 2011</SPAN>. The Congress is organized to invite international delegates, to
> share their latest research findings on Electronics and Electrical
> Engineering. WCEEENG'11 is organized by INFOMESR.</FONT></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3>Papers on original works
> are solicited on a variety of topics, including but not limited to the
> following congress tracks:</FONT></P><FONT size=3>
> <P><STRONG><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN></STRONG></P>
> <UL>
> <LI>Electrical Power
> <LI>Telecommunication
> <LI>Computer Science and Engineering
> <LI>Biotechnology
> <LI>Electronics
> <LI>Control Systems and Robotics
> <LI>Signal Processing
> <LI>Circuits and Systems
> <LI>Electromagnetics
> <LI>Electrical Materials
> <LI>Optoelctronics
> <LI>Mechatronics
> <LI>Student Session
> <LI>Other Related Fields</LI></UL></FONT>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3><B><I><U>Submission:
> <BR></U></I></B><BR>Please submit full papers to the Conference website
> address: </FONT><A href="http://infomesr.org/paper%20submission.html"><SPAN
> style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>infomesr.org/paper$20submission.html</FONT></SPAN></A><A
> href="http://edas.info/N8796" target=_blank></A><FONT
> size=3>.<BR><BR>Further information can be obtained from the following
> website:</FONT></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A href="
> http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences
> 
">domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences</A></FONT><A
> href="
> 
http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences"><SPAN
> style="COLOR: black"><FONT size=3></FONT></SPAN></A><FONT size=3>
> </FONT></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><o:p><FONT size=3> </FONT></o:p></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>Important Dates/Deadlines:
> Paper Submission Deadline: Dec. 31, 2010<BR><BR>kindly forward this email to
> other interested
> 
parties.<BR> <BR>Regards<BR>--------------------------------<BR>Conferences Rapporteur<BR>Tel. (002 - 010) 6896063<BR>Fax. (002 - 02) 24488366</FONT></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT
> 
size=3>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</FONT></P>
> <P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed;
> DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT
> 
size=3>* All replies must be directed to: </FONT><A
> href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><FONT
> size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P><SPAN
> style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-ansi-language:
> EN-US; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-language:
> EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">* To avoid spam, when reply, please,
> replace [AT] with @ and [dot] with
> 
.<BR>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>



-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
ashbb
Date:
2010-09-18 @ 06:58
Spam?

ashbb

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-18 @ 07:03
Yeah, looks like it.

On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 11:58 PM, ashbb <ashbbb@gmail.com> wrote:

> Spam?
>
> ashbb
>



-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Cecil Coupe
Date:
2010-09-18 @ 08:15
More likely that it a simple error. Someone that subscribes to our Shoes
list and and is also part of the WCEENG (which seems to be MSFT Exchange
centric) just selected the wrong mailing list to send to. 

No big deal. I remember when some clerical person sent an email with
custom stationary (MS-Word) to the the whole company mailing list
mistakenly third of the company replied WTF? (all replies included the
stationary payload). When she realized her error, she sent an "I'm
sorry" to the whole company, with stationary attachment.

The mail server died. For all I know, 12 years later, those queue files
are on a backup server, waiting to a restore.

On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 00:03 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> Yeah, looks like it.
> 
> On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 11:58 PM, ashbb <ashbbb@gmail.com> wrote:
>         Spam?
>         
>         ashbb
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
>     ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Zachary Scott
Date:
2010-09-18 @ 16:01
Haha, here lies dead email. REST IN PEACE.

If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make
a sound?

Custom email stationary is hopefully a thing of the past. Now the annoying
thing is 30 lines of signature text with logo images, different types of
font's and colors. Oh and a huge privacy clause, which is kind of ironic
considering how insecure email truely is. Almost as annoying as the "sent
from my iphone" crap, (like it makes a difference!!)



On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 4:15 AM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:

> More likely that it a simple error. Someone that subscribes to our Shoes
> list and and is also part of the WCEENG (which seems to be MSFT Exchange
> centric) just selected the wrong mailing list to send to.
>
> No big deal. I remember when some clerical person sent an email with
> custom stationary (MS-Word) to the the whole company mailing list
> mistakenly third of the company replied WTF? (all replies included the
> stationary payload). When she realized her error, she sent an "I'm
> sorry" to the whole company, with stationary attachment.
>
> The mail server died. For all I know, 12 years later, those queue files
> are on a backup server, waiting to a restore.
>
> On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 00:03 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> > Yeah, looks like it.
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 11:58 PM, ashbb <ashbbb@gmail.com> wrote:
> >         Spam?
> >
> >         ashbb
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >     ~devyn
>
>
>


-- 
Zachary Scott

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 01:32
It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked the concept.
Hopefully someone else develops it.

On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:01 AM, Zachary Scott <zachary.s.scott@gmail.com>wrote:

> Haha, here lies dead email. REST IN PEACE.
>
> If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make
> a sound?
>
> Custom email stationary is hopefully a thing of the past. Now the annoying
> thing is 30 lines of signature text with logo images, different types of
> font's and colors. Oh and a huge privacy clause, which is kind of ironic
> considering how insecure email truely is. Almost as annoying as the "sent
> from my iphone" crap, (like it makes a difference!!)
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 4:15 AM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:
>
>> More likely that it a simple error. Someone that subscribes to our Shoes
>> list and and is also part of the WCEENG (which seems to be MSFT Exchange
>> centric) just selected the wrong mailing list to send to.
>>
>> No big deal. I remember when some clerical person sent an email with
>> custom stationary (MS-Word) to the the whole company mailing list
>> mistakenly third of the company replied WTF? (all replies included the
>> stationary payload). When she realized her error, she sent an "I'm
>> sorry" to the whole company, with stationary attachment.
>>
>> The mail server died. For all I know, 12 years later, those queue files
>> are on a backup server, waiting to a restore.
>>
>> On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 00:03 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
>> > Yeah, looks like it.
>> >
>> > On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 11:58 PM, ashbb <ashbbb@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >         Spam?
>> >
>> >         ashbb
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> >     ~devyn
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Zachary Scott
>



-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Cecil Coupe
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 04:11
On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 18:32 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked the
> concept. Hopefully someone else develops it.
> 
We're going off topic, but that's OK. Google Wave reminds me of Apple's
Cyberdog/OpenDoc. Interesting ideas, but a technology in search of a
problem to solve. Turned out that not many folks really cared about the
problem. Java Jini was cool too but not enough traction. *Some* of the
technology of those projects live on. There might be a lesson for Shoes
in all of that. or not. 

> On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:01 AM, Zachary Scott
> <zachary.s.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
>          Almost as annoying as the "sent from my iphone" crap, (like
>         it makes a difference!!)
It makes a difference to Apple and to the iPhone owner ;-) You negative
Nancy, you!

If you know how STMP works with all the cruft layered on top of that,
it's really amazing that it works at all. Every email delivered is a
miracle of open-source 'good enough' practices.
--Cecil



Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 04:26
On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:11 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:

> On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 18:32 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> > It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked the
> > concept. Hopefully someone else develops it.
> >
> We're going off topic, but that's OK. Google Wave reminds me of Apple's
> Cyberdog/OpenDoc. Interesting ideas, but a technology in search of a
> problem to solve.


Personally, it did solve a lot of problems for me. Being able to edit things
after you've sent them is one. Nested threading is another—something I often
wish email supported, especially in mailing lists. Live communication—but
not just that, live communication with full, complex formatting! I've yet to
see an IM which supports as much rich formatting as Wave does.

And it was so incredibly useful for document collaboration. Several people
could type at the same time without any merge conflicts or anything!
Conversations could take place in-document! My friends and I used this
aspect a lot.

Sadly, it was also missing a lot of things. They had an inter-server
protocol, but no client/server protocol (meaning alternatives to the HTML5
UI, which many people disliked, were not possible). When compared to email,
Wave had an SMTP but no IMAP.

Yet another thing: I think XMPP was a poor choice for a foundation for the
federation protocol. Something so verbose as XML is never a good idea for a
realtime protocol.

So, unlike many, I think Wave actually did solve a lot of problems; maybe
without knowing exactly what their goal was, but the ideas were great.


> Turned out that not many folks really cared about the
> problem. Java Jini was cool too but not enough traction. *Some* of the
> technology of those projects live on. There might be a lesson for Shoes
> in all of that. or not.
>

Perhaps, yes.


>
> > On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:01 AM, Zachary Scott
> > <zachary.s.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
> >          Almost as annoying as the "sent from my iphone" crap, (like
> >         it makes a difference!!)
> It makes a difference to Apple and to the iPhone owner ;-) You negative
> Nancy, you!
>
> If you know how STMP works with all the cruft layered on top of that,
> it's really amazing that it works at all. Every email delivered is a
> miracle of open-source 'good enough' practices.
> --Cecil
>
>
>
>
>


-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Cecil Coupe
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 05:47
On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 21:26 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> 
> 
> On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:11 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net>
> wrote:
>         On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 18:32 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
>         > It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked
>         the
>         > concept. Hopefully someone else develops it.
>         >
>         
>         We're going off topic, but that's OK. Google Wave reminds me
>         of Apple's
>         Cyberdog/OpenDoc. Interesting ideas, but a technology in
>         search of a
>         problem to solve.
> 
> 
> Personally, it did solve a lot of problems for me. Being able to edit
> things after you've sent them is one. Nested threading is another—
> something I often wish email supported, especially in mailing lists.
> Live communication—but not just that, live communication with full,
> complex formatting! I've yet to see an IM which supports as much rich
> formatting as Wave does.
> 
> 
> And it was so incredibly useful for document collaboration. Several
> people could type at the same time without any merge conflicts or
> anything! Conversations could take place in-document! My friends and I
> used this aspect a lot.
> 
> 
> Sadly, it was also missing a lot of things. They had an inter-server
> protocol, but no client/server protocol (meaning alternatives to the
> HTML5 UI, which many people disliked, were not possible). When
> compared to email, Wave had an SMTP but no IMAP.
> 
No IMAP? That's odd. Wave also required a google account and at the time
it was announced, I didn't want one more account at the next big
brother. Since then my ISP outsourced it's mail handling to Google while
pretending the email is from their Exchange servers. A PITA if you
happen to run a linux smarthost smtp server.
> 
> Yet another thing: I think XMPP was a poor choice for a foundation for
> the federation protocol. Something so verbose as XML is never a good
> idea for a realtime protocol.
There is no RFC for distributed threaded email comments (that I'm aware
of) so Google had to centralize it to their servers/protocols/vision and
XML is the best way to carry that load and still be mostly not evil.
> 
> 
> So, unlike many, I think Wave actually did solve a lot of problems;
> maybe without knowing exactly what their goal was, but the ideas were
> great.
>  
>         Turned out that not many folks really cared about the
>         problem. Java Jini was cool too but not enough traction.
>         *Some* of the
>         technology of those projects live on. There might be a lesson
>         for Shoes
>         in all of that. or not.
> 
> 
> Perhaps, yes.
Actually, there are many lessons to learn in those failures that could
apply to Shoes:
1) don't depend on a single vendor or person to lead you to the next
Kool-Aid refill station. 
2) some other stuff about the pursuit for perfection being the enemy of
useful. [snipped]

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 18:25
On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 10:47 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:

> On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 21:26 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:11 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net>
> > wrote:
> >         On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 18:32 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> >         > It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked
> >         the
> >         > concept. Hopefully someone else develops it.
> >         >
> >
> >         We're going off topic, but that's OK. Google Wave reminds me
> >         of Apple's
> >         Cyberdog/OpenDoc. Interesting ideas, but a technology in
> >         search of a
> >         problem to solve.
> >
> >
> > Personally, it did solve a lot of problems for me. Being able to edit
> > things after you've sent them is one. Nested threading is another—
> > something I often wish email supported, especially in mailing lists.
> > Live communication—but not just that, live communication with full,
> > complex formatting! I've yet to see an IM which supports as much rich
> > formatting as Wave does.
> >
> >
> > And it was so incredibly useful for document collaboration. Several
> > people could type at the same time without any merge conflicts or
> > anything! Conversations could take place in-document! My friends and I
> > used this aspect a lot.
> >
> >
> > Sadly, it was also missing a lot of things. They had an inter-server
> > protocol, but no client/server protocol (meaning alternatives to the
> > HTML5 UI, which many people disliked, were not possible). When
> > compared to email, Wave had an SMTP but no IMAP.
> >
> No IMAP? That's odd. Wave also required a google account and at the time
> it was announced, I didn't want one more account at the next big
> brother.


Well, no IMAP-equivalent protocol. But I suppose that's what you meant.

And I don't mind Google having my information, I know that they have a
legally binding privacy policy and security incidents are rare. GMail is
just so incredibly useful.

Wave was going to be completely decentralized—so if it ever went anywhere
(which, unfortunately, it didn't) other servers would emerge, as with email.
There were open-source Wave server projects going on so that you could run
your own server, if you wanted to.

Google's usually pretty good with the friendly competition thing. They try
to be compatible with all of the popular standards and formats, and they use
a lot of open-source technology.

That said, they are a company, and their goal is to make money… which is
part of the reason why if there's an open-source equivalent that's just as
good or better, I'll use it.


> Since then my ISP outsourced it's mail handling to Google while
> pretending the email is from their Exchange servers. A PITA if you
> happen to run a linux smarthost smtp server.
> >
> > Yet another thing: I think XMPP was a poor choice for a foundation for
> > the federation protocol. Something so verbose as XML is never a good
> > idea for a realtime protocol.
> There is no RFC for distributed threaded email comments (that I'm aware
> of) so Google had to centralize it to their servers/protocols/vision and
> XML is the best way to carry that load and still be mostly not evil.
> >
> >
> > So, unlike many, I think Wave actually did solve a lot of problems;
> > maybe without knowing exactly what their goal was, but the ideas were
> > great.
> >
> >         Turned out that not many folks really cared about the
> >         problem. Java Jini was cool too but not enough traction.
> >         *Some* of the
> >         technology of those projects live on. There might be a lesson
> >         for Shoes
> >         in all of that. or not.
> >
> >
> > Perhaps, yes.
> Actually, there are many lessons to learn in those failures that could
> apply to Shoes:
> 1) don't depend on a single vendor or person to lead you to the next
> Kool-Aid refill station.
> 2) some other stuff about the pursuit for perfection being the enemy of
> useful. [snipped]
>
>
>


-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-19 @ 18:37
Speaking of editing things after you've written them, I forgot to reply to
the rest of your message, lol.

On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 10:47 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:

> On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 21:26 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 9:11 PM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net>
> > wrote:
> >         On Sat, 2010-09-18 at 18:32 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> >         > It's really too bad that Google screwed up on Wave. I liked
> >         the
> >         > concept. Hopefully someone else develops it.
> >         >
> >
> >         We're going off topic, but that's OK. Google Wave reminds me
> >         of Apple's
> >         Cyberdog/OpenDoc. Interesting ideas, but a technology in
> >         search of a
> >         problem to solve.
> >
> >
> > Personally, it did solve a lot of problems for me. Being able to edit
> > things after you've sent them is one. Nested threading is another—
> > something I often wish email supported, especially in mailing lists.
> > Live communication—but not just that, live communication with full,
> > complex formatting! I've yet to see an IM which supports as much rich
> > formatting as Wave does.
> >
> >
> > And it was so incredibly useful for document collaboration. Several
> > people could type at the same time without any merge conflicts or
> > anything! Conversations could take place in-document! My friends and I
> > used this aspect a lot.
> >
> >
> > Sadly, it was also missing a lot of things. They had an inter-server
> > protocol, but no client/server protocol (meaning alternatives to the
> > HTML5 UI, which many people disliked, were not possible). When
> > compared to email, Wave had an SMTP but no IMAP.
> >
> No IMAP? That's odd. Wave also required a google account and at the time
> it was announced, I didn't want one more account at the next big
> brother. Since then my ISP outsourced it's mail handling to Google while
> pretending the email is from their Exchange servers. A PITA if you
> happen to run a linux smarthost smtp server.
> >
> > Yet another thing: I think XMPP was a poor choice for a foundation for
> > the federation protocol. Something so verbose as XML is never a good
> > idea for a realtime protocol.
> There is no RFC for distributed threaded email comments (that I'm aware
> of) so Google had to centralize it to their servers/protocols/vision and
> XML is the best way to carry that load and still be mostly not evil.
>

No, but Wave wasn't just that. You really had to use Wave a lot to
understand what it was. I mean, this would send like 6 lines of XML every
time someone typed a little piece of text, 3 of which were completely
unnecessary (the end tags)

XML is just so verbose. There are far better formats for serializing data.

<products>
  <product id="7243">
    An apple pie.
  </product>
  <product id="404">
    Page not found.
  </product>
</products>

vs. the YAML:

products:
- id: 7243
  description: An apple pie.
- id: 404
  description: Page not found.

vs. the JSON:

{"products": [
  {"id": 7243, "description": "An apple pie."},
  {"id": 404, "description": "Page not found."}
]}

Almost every system has an XML parser, but it's very verbose. Less have a
JSON parser, but JSON is a lot easier to parse. YAML is the most complex to
parse, but it's also very readable and powerful.


> >
> >
> > So, unlike many, I think Wave actually did solve a lot of problems;
> > maybe without knowing exactly what their goal was, but the ideas were
> > great.
> >
> >         Turned out that not many folks really cared about the
> >         problem. Java Jini was cool too but not enough traction.
> >         *Some* of the
> >         technology of those projects live on. There might be a lesson
> >         for Shoes
> >         in all of that. or not.
> >
> >
> > Perhaps, yes.
> Actually, there are many lessons to learn in those failures that could
> apply to Shoes:
> 1) don't depend on a single vendor or person to lead you to the next
> Kool-Aid refill station.
> 2) some other stuff about the pursuit for perfection being the enemy of
> useful. [snipped]
>
>
>


-- 
    ~devyn

[WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Wceeeng 2011
Date:
2010-09-28 @ 18:02
<HTML xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META name=GENERATOR content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.18943"></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>* We apologize if you 
receive multiple copies of this CFP<BR></FONT><FONT 
size=3>==========================================================<BR>Congress
Announcement: Full Paper Submission Deadline (Dec. 31, 
2010)<BR>==========================================================<BR><BR>It
is our great pleasure to announce the <SPAN style="COLOR: red">2011 World 
Congress on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering (WCEEENG'11)</SPAN> to be held in <SPAN style="COLOR: 
red">Cairo, Egypt</SPAN>, <SPAN style="COLOR: red">4 - 7 April 
2011</SPAN>. The Congress is organized to invite international delegates, 
to share their latest research findings on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering. WCEEENG'11 is organized by INFOMESR.</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3>Papers on original works 
are solicited on a variety of topics, including but not limited to the 
following congress tracks:</FONT></P><FONT size=3>
<P><STRONG><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN></STRONG></P>
<UL>
<LI>Electrical Power 
<LI>Telecommunication 
<LI>Computer Science and Engineering 
<LI>Biotechnology 
<LI>Electronics 
<LI>Control Systems and Robotics 
<LI>Signal Processing 
<LI>Circuits and Systems 
<LI>Electromagnetics 
<LI>Electrical Materials 
<LI>Optoelctronics 
<LI>Mechatronics 
<LI>Student Session 
<LI>Other Related Fields</LI></UL></FONT>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3><B><I><U>Submission: 
<BR></U></I></B><BR>Please submit your abstract to the Conference website 
address:</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A 
href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/paper-submission">http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/paper-submission</A></FONT><FONT
size=3><BR></FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>and full paper as attached 
file to our email:</FONT></P><FONT size=3></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"><FONT size=3>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><A href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN 
style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal> </P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal>Further information can be obtained from 
the following website:</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A 
href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences">domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences</A></FONT><A

href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences"><SPAN
style="COLOR: black"><FONT size=3></FONT></SPAN></A><FONT size=3> 
</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><o:p><FONT size=3> </FONT></o:p></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>Important Dates/Deadlines: 
Paper Submission Deadline: Dec. 31, 2010<BR><BR>kindly forward this email 
to other interested parties.<BR></FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>Regards<BR>--------------------------------<BR>Conferences Rapporteur<BR>Tel. (002 - 010) 6896063<BR>Fax. (002 - 02) 24488366</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>----------------------------------------------------------------------------</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>* All replies must be directed to: </FONT><A
href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-ansi-language:
EN-US; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-language: 
EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">* To avoid spam, when reply, please, 
replace [AT] with @ and [dot] with 
.<BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------------</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Devyn Cairns
Date:
2010-09-29 @ 04:10
Can someone take admin@infomesr.org off the list? This is the second time
this has happened.

-- 
    ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Cecil Coupe
Date:
2010-09-29 @ 06:53
FWIW, I sent a polite email to  admin@infomesr.org asking them to stop
sending to the list. I suspect that won't get any traction but it's
worth a try.  Unless they apologize to the list, real damn soon, I
second Devyn's request to remove them from shoes@librelist list of
authorized senders.

Then again, just about anything might make the list seem alive.

On Tue, 2010-09-28 at 21:10 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> Can someone take admin@infomesr.org off the list? This is the second
> time this has happened.
> 
> -- 
>     ~devyn

Re: [shoes] [WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
i5m
Date:
2010-09-29 @ 08:18
The thing with librelist though is that it's "libre", in the sense of being
open for anyone to access without censorship (spam excepted) and as such
there are no admins or admin tools. Someone reported on the Meta mailing
list receiving a similar message in their mailing list (See third link
down: http://librelist.com/browser/meta/ (direct link doesn't work, perhaps
removed from archives as it is spam?). Doesn't look like anyone has opened a
ticket though.

http://support.librelist.com/rptview?rn=1

<http://support.librelist.com/rptview?rn=1>Might be worth doing.
-----------------------
i5m.co.uk
GPG Key: 0xA18A602B


On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 7:53 AM, Cecil Coupe <ccoupe@cableone.net> wrote:

> FWIW, I sent a polite email to  admin@infomesr.org asking them to stop
> sending to the list. I suspect that won't get any traction but it's
> worth a try.  Unless they apologize to the list, real damn soon, I
> second Devyn's request to remove them from shoes@librelist list of
> authorized senders.
>
> Then again, just about anything might make the list seem alive.
>
> On Tue, 2010-09-28 at 21:10 -0700, Devyn Cairns wrote:
> > Can someone take admin@infomesr.org off the list? This is the second
> > time this has happened.
> >
> > --
> >     ~devyn
>
>
>

[WCEEENG 2011] Announcement: The 2011 World Congress on Electronics and Electrical Engineering

From:
Wceeeng 2011
Date:
2010-09-28 @ 18:02
<HTML xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META name=GENERATOR content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.18943"></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>* We apologize if you 
receive multiple copies of this CFP<BR></FONT><FONT 
size=3>==========================================================<BR>Congress
Announcement: Full Paper Submission Deadline (Dec. 31, 
2010)<BR>==========================================================<BR><BR>It
is our great pleasure to announce the <SPAN style="COLOR: red">2011 World 
Congress on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering (WCEEENG'11)</SPAN> to be held in <SPAN style="COLOR: 
red">Cairo, Egypt</SPAN>, <SPAN style="COLOR: red">4 - 7 April 
2011</SPAN>. The Congress is organized to invite international delegates, 
to share their latest research findings on Electronics and Electrical 
Engineering. WCEEENG'11 is organized by INFOMESR.</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3>Papers on original works 
are solicited on a variety of topics, including but not limited to the 
following congress tracks:</FONT></P><FONT size=3>
<P><STRONG><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN></STRONG></P>
<UL>
<LI>Electrical Power 
<LI>Telecommunication 
<LI>Computer Science and Engineering 
<LI>Biotechnology 
<LI>Electronics 
<LI>Control Systems and Robotics 
<LI>Signal Processing 
<LI>Circuits and Systems 
<LI>Electromagnetics 
<LI>Electrical Materials 
<LI>Optoelctronics 
<LI>Mechatronics 
<LI>Student Session 
<LI>Other Related Fields</LI></UL></FONT>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><BR><FONT size=3><B><I><U>Submission: 
<BR></U></I></B><BR>Please submit your abstract to the Conference website 
address:</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A 
href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/paper-submission">http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/paper-submission</A></FONT><FONT
size=3><BR></FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>and full paper as attached 
file to our email:</FONT></P><FONT size=3></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT size=4 face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"><FONT size=3>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><A href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN 
style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal> </P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal>Further information can be obtained from 
the following website:</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><A 
href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences">domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences</A></FONT><A

href="http://domacj.com/infomesr/en/scientific-research/conferences/2011-conferences"><SPAN
style="COLOR: black"><FONT size=3></FONT></SPAN></A><FONT size=3> 
</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><o:p><FONT size=3> </FONT></o:p></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3>Important Dates/Deadlines: 
Paper Submission Deadline: Dec. 31, 2010<BR><BR>kindly forward this email 
to other interested parties.<BR></FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>Regards<BR>--------------------------------<BR>Conferences Rapporteur<BR>Tel. (002 - 010) 6896063<BR>Fax. (002 - 02) 24488366</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>----------------------------------------------------------------------------</FONT></P>
<P style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; unicode-bidi: embed; 
DIRECTION: ltr" class=MsoNormal><FONT 
size=3>* All replies must be directed to: </FONT><A
href="mailto:admin@infomesr.org"><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><FONT 
size=3>admin[AT]infomesr[dot]org</FONT></SPAN></A></P><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-ansi-language:
EN-US; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-language: 
EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">* To avoid spam, when reply, please, 
replace [AT] with @ and [dot] with 
.<BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------------</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>