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Editors / IDEs

Editors / IDEs

From:
Phil Cohen
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 20:48
What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?

I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.

Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every 
way … so how do you Clojure?


- Phil

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Corfield
Date:
2013-05-22 @ 04:10
On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:

> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?


When I first started learning Clojure, I used a mixture of TextMate with
the Clojure bundle and Eclipse with Counterclockwise. I was used to both
editors already and that made it easier to focus on learning Clojure.

After a while tho', I began to find the workflow in TM a little clunky and
the "weight" of Eclipse to be too much. Also, seeing everyone else using
Emacs (well, 70% of Clojure developers surveyed in the "state of the union"
that Chas Emerick runs), I decided to go back to Emacs after a 20 year
break.

It's definitely got a learning curve - a learning cliff? - but currently
provides the most seamless workflow for Clojure, with packages for all the
test frameworks and all sorts of utilities. I like being able to open one
program and write every language I need, connect to live running Clojure
instances and evaluate code easily, run multiple command line shells, do
IRC, interact with Git, run test suites, and do basically everything I need
as a developer without needing to switch programs.

Sean

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
David Mitchell
Date:
2013-05-22 @ 08:48
Hi Sean,

Any tips for shortening that Emacs learning curve?

I know Emacs can be setup to work fantastically well with the other tools I
work with (Python, Erlang, Clojure, git, Mercurial, Ruby, ...), but there
doesn't seem be a "definitive" source of info for these.  I see how the
Emacs gurus have their development environments set up and think "That's
what I want", but don't quite know how to get there.  I've used the
emacs-starter-kit and it's definitely made life easier, but "easier" and
"easy" are very different things!

As a newbie Emacs user, I'm finding that's the most frustrating aspect of
learning it - actually tracking down info on how to set everything up to
use it in conjunction with all the other tools I use.  I'd pay for
"Emacs+Clojure for Dummies", "Emac+git for Dummies" etc. if only they
existed somewhere and were broadly acknowledged as being "the best source
of info".

Probably a big part of the problem is that my expectations of what I could
do with Emacs are sky-high, compared to what I already do with vim, ST2,
etc.  For pure editing, I can actually probably already use Emacs as well
as those tools; it's just all the other stuff that I want to get working!


On 22 May 2013 14:10, Sean Corfield <sean@corfield.org> wrote:

> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:
>
>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>
>
> When I first started learning Clojure, I used a mixture of TextMate with
> the Clojure bundle and Eclipse with Counterclockwise. I was used to both
> editors already and that made it easier to focus on learning Clojure.
>
> After a while tho', I began to find the workflow in TM a little clunky and
> the "weight" of Eclipse to be too much. Also, seeing everyone else using
> Emacs (well, 70% of Clojure developers surveyed in the "state of the union"
> that Chas Emerick runs), I decided to go back to Emacs after a 20 year
> break.
>
> It's definitely got a learning curve - a learning cliff? - but currently
> provides the most seamless workflow for Clojure, with packages for all the
> test frameworks and all sorts of utilities. I like being able to open one
> program and write every language I need, connect to live running Clojure
> instances and evaluate code easily, run multiple command line shells, do
> IRC, interact with Git, run test suites, and do basically everything I need
> as a developer without needing to switch programs.
>
> Sean
>
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Corfield
Date:
2013-05-24 @ 05:25
On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 1:48 AM, David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com> wrote:

> Any tips for shortening that Emacs learning curve?
>

Not really :(

About the only advice I can give is - force yourself to use only Emacs for
all editing for the first few weeks, no cheating.


> As a newbie Emacs user, I'm finding that's the most frustrating aspect of
> learning it - actually tracking down info on how to set everything up to
> use it in conjunction with all the other tools I use.  I'd pay for
> "Emacs+Clojure for Dummies", "Emac+git for Dummies" etc. if only they
> existed somewhere and were broadly acknowledged as being "the best source
> of info".
>

One of the very strange phenomena I've encountered is a resistance to
documenting things. On the grounds that nearly all the blog posts out there
are out of date, many Emacs experts don't want more out of date material
laid down. I've offered to write up my experiences of installing and
configuring Emacs 23/24 on Ubuntu, OS X, and Windows XP / 8... but been
told not to do it.

Every Emacs user has a unique configuration. There are several "live"
configurations on Github, but it's a very personal choice.

Sean

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
David Mitchell
Date:
2013-05-24 @ 11:21
Thanks Sean,

Good idea - no editors except Emacs for me for at least a week, then I'll
take stock.

Gulp!  I just realised I've got both Python and C dev work to do in that
time, besides my Clojure project.  Surely there's gotta be some
ipython/Emacs integration stuff out there somewhere...



On 24 May 2013 15:25, Sean Corfield <sean@corfield.org> wrote:

> On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 1:48 AM, David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Any tips for shortening that Emacs learning curve?
>>
>
> Not really :(
>
> About the only advice I can give is - force yourself to use only Emacs for
> all editing for the first few weeks, no cheating.
>
>
>> As a newbie Emacs user, I'm finding that's the most frustrating aspect of
>> learning it - actually tracking down info on how to set everything up to
>> use it in conjunction with all the other tools I use.  I'd pay for
>> "Emacs+Clojure for Dummies", "Emac+git for Dummies" etc. if only they
>> existed somewhere and were broadly acknowledged as being "the best source
>> of info".
>>
>
> One of the very strange phenomena I've encountered is a resistance to
> documenting things. On the grounds that nearly all the blog posts out there
> are out of date, many Emacs experts don't want more out of date material
> laid down. I've offered to write up my experiences of installing and
> configuring Emacs 23/24 on Ubuntu, OS X, and Windows XP / 8... but been
> told not to do it.
>
> Every Emacs user has a unique configuration. There are several "live"
> configurations on Github, but it's a very personal choice.
>
> Sean
>
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Adrian Gruntkowski
Date:
2013-05-24 @ 11:26
Sorry for going off topic but this looks like quite up to date resource
about setting up Emacs for Python development:
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/PythonProgrammingInEmacs

--
Adrian


2013/5/24 David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com>

> Thanks Sean,
>
> Good idea - no editors except Emacs for me for at least a week, then I'll
> take stock.
>
> Gulp!  I just realised I've got both Python and C dev work to do in that
> time, besides my Clojure project.  Surely there's gotta be some
> ipython/Emacs integration stuff out there somewhere...
>
>
>
> On 24 May 2013 15:25, Sean Corfield <sean@corfield.org> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 1:48 AM, David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Any tips for shortening that Emacs learning curve?
>>>
>>
>> Not really :(
>>
>> About the only advice I can give is - force yourself to use only Emacs
>> for all editing for the first few weeks, no cheating.
>>
>>
>>> As a newbie Emacs user, I'm finding that's the most frustrating aspect
>>> of learning it - actually tracking down info on how to set everything up to
>>> use it in conjunction with all the other tools I use.  I'd pay for
>>> "Emacs+Clojure for Dummies", "Emac+git for Dummies" etc. if only they
>>> existed somewhere and were broadly acknowledged as being "the best source
>>> of info".
>>>
>>
>> One of the very strange phenomena I've encountered is a resistance to
>> documenting things. On the grounds that nearly all the blog posts out there
>> are out of date, many Emacs experts don't want more out of date material
>> laid down. I've offered to write up my experiences of installing and
>> configuring Emacs 23/24 on Ubuntu, OS X, and Windows XP / 8... but been
>> told not to do it.
>>
>> Every Emacs user has a unique configuration. There are several "live"
>> configurations on Github, but it's a very personal choice.
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Corfield
Date:
2013-05-24 @ 14:43
On May 24, 2013, at 4:26 AM, Adrian Gruntkowski wrote:
> Sorry for going off topic but this looks like quite up to date resource 
about setting up Emacs for Python development: 
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/PythonProgrammingInEmacs

Yup, I do a little Python and I use Emacs for it (well, I use Emacs for 
everything). On OS X, if you have both Python 2.x and 3.x installed, a 
useful tip is:

When you want to run Python, press C-u then M-x run-python and you will be
prompted for the command used to start Python (which will be `python` by 
default). You can then choose `ipython` or `python3` or whatever else you 
have installed.

Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN
An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/

"Perfection is the enemy of the good."
-- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880)



Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Clinton Dreisbach
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 20:51
I'm an Emacs guy normally, but vim-fireplace is freaking fantastic,
and I recommend it if you already know vim. There is no significant
advantage to learning Emacs over using vim-fireplace if you're already
knowledge with vim. Others may disagree, obviously.

-- Clinton

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 4:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:
> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>
> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>
> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
way … so how do you Clojure?
>
>
> - Phil

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-18 @ 08:50
Stuart got back to me with this.  I haven't tried it yet:


https://github.com/stuartsierra/dotfiles/blob/d0d1c46ccc4fdd8d2add363615e625cc29d035b0/.emacs#L363-L372
------------------------------
From: Mark Stang
Sent: 17/05/2013 10:37 PM
To: foray@librelist.com
Subject: Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

I always do it manually.  Do you follow him on twitter?  I would post a
question there.
If you are not, I am and I could ask.

regards,

Mark


On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:15 AM, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:

> At Lambda Jam when Stuart Sierra was showing us Datomic he seemed to have
> a command in emacs that pasted the current expression into the nrepl
> window.  When I use C-c C-e it evaluates it but doesn't actually copy the
> code into the nrepl window.
>
> Does anyone know how to do this?  I should have asked him I guess!
>
> Andrew
>
> On 17/05/2013, at 9:49 PM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:
>
> > Regarding LightTable.
> >
> > You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (> 0.4)
> appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned from
> Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code and
> learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue compiling and
> evaluate the code.
> >
> > One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs
> sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more
> effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
> source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when I
> really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.
> >
> > What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).
> >
> > Just sharing my experience.
> >
> > Best regards, i-blis.
> >
> >
> > On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:
> >
> >> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
> >> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have
> used Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
> >> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in
> Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine,
> ymmv.
> >>
> >> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried
> that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my Clojure
> code.
> >> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move around.
> However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
> >> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from
> within vim.
> >>
> >> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my projects
> and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single
> form.
> >> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some
> loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I have
> high hopes for it in the future.
> >> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
> >>
> >> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. At
> first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it a
> go and then give up.
> >> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said, emacs
> understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl is easy
> to start, kill and see results.
> >> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the
> running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the
> messages at the bottom of the screen.
> >> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all
> my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
> >> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers is
> time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim key-bindings.
> >> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
> >>
> >> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however,
> after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now
> it makes sense.
> >> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is basically,
> a C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
> >> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more
> powerful.
> >>
> >> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it
> yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
> >>
> >> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best for
> lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
> >> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
> >>
> >> regards,
> >>
> >> Mark
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru (mailto:
> i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
> >>> Greetings to everyone.
> >>>
> >>> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and
> Sublime Text for more casual things.
> >>>
> >>> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for
> experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light
> Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good
> subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
> to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but for
> the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
> >>>
> >>> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in
> connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode
> (with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very
> similar to Emacs Live in a way.
> >>>
> >>> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
> >>>
> >>> i-blis.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks for that link also.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> >>>>> Andrew,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> >>>>> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while
> in
> >>>>> shell mode.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master.
> I do
> >>>>> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a
> time ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Walter
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hey Walter,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> >>>>> the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
> >>>>> cheatsheet?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
> >>>>>
> >>>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both
> the
> >>>>> editor and a new language?
> >>>>> I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> >>>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> >>>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
> >>>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> >>>>>
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
> :
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
> >>>>>
> >>>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> >>>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> >>>>> cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
> >>>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Any ideas?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Andrew.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same
> time. It
> >>>>> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs
> users. I
> >>>>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts
> before, but
> >>>>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was
> enough
> >>>>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> >>>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file
> will load
> >>>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file.
> Paredit is
> >>>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to
> Eclipse or
> >>>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but
> it was
> >>>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so
> well.
> >>>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome.
> I use it
> >>>>> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python,
> javascript and
> >>>>> HTML editing work well too.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ymmv
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Walter
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at
> the
> >>>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> >>>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
> every way
> >>>>> … so how do you Clojure?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> - Phil
> >
> >
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Corfield
Date:
2013-05-26 @ 17:15
Just added this to my local init.el - very nice.

I added a local key binding for C-c e bound to this to make it easier to 
use (C-c n is bound to nrepl-set-ns for me as well, easier than C-c M-n).

;; better eval in nrepl from stuart sierra
(defun nrepl-eval-expression-at-point-in-repl ()
  (interactive)
  (let ((form (nrepl-expression-at-point)))
    ;; Strip excess whitespace
    (while (string-match "\\`\s+\\|\n+\\'" form)
      (setq form (replace-match "" t t form)))
    (set-buffer "*nrepl*")
    (goto-char (point-max))
    (insert form)
    (nrepl-return)))
;; force clojure-mode into paredit-mode etc
(add-hook 'clojure-mode-hook
          (lambda ()
            (progn
              (paredit-mode 1)
              (local-set-key (kbd "C-c n") 'nrepl-set-ns)
              (local-set-key (kbd "C-c e") 
'nrepl-eval-expression-at-point-in-repl))))
(add-hook 'nrepl-mode-hook (lambda () (paredit-mode 1)))

On May 18, 2013, at 1:50 AM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> Stuart got back to me with this.  I haven't tried it yet:
> 
> 
https://github.com/stuartsierra/dotfiles/blob/d0d1c46ccc4fdd8d2add363615e625cc29d035b0/.emacs#L363-L372


Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Walter Babic
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 22:05
They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. It
also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I 
decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el. 

M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.

ymmv

-Walter


On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:

> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> 
> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> 
> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
way … so how do you Clojure?
> 
> 
> - Phil

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 14:10
Hi,

I spent a few hours with emacs and nrepl tonight.  I referred to this 
email from Walter quite a few times - there's some great tips here.

With paredit I am really only using three  things but its enough that I no
longer have to keep switching it off to get me out of trouble.

These are:

C-right arrow 
C-left arrow

Those two commands move the nearest paren (or square bracket, brace, 
double quote) either right or left one level.  I think the gurus call this
"slurp" and "barf"?  But I'm not sure which is which off the top of my 
head :)

The other one is M-s which deletes the surrounding parens (or other tokens
as per above).  When I discovered this I was away.

I'm sure there's much more to paredit but this has been enough to get me going.

Andrew

On 16/05/2013, at 8:05 AM, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:

> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. 
It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. 
I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, 
but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was 
enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el. 
> 
> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.
> 
> ymmv
> 
> -Walter
> 
> 
> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
> 
>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>> 
>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>> 
>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in 
every way … so how do you Clojure?
>> 
>> 
>> - Phil
> 

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Mark Stang
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 16:27
Thanks for the tip.

I am always using C-M-k, it deletes the form in front of of the point.
Then you can "paste" (C-y) it inside.
I think I may use your recommendations, looks like it might make it a lot
easier.


On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 8:10 AM, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I spent a few hours with emacs and nrepl tonight.  I referred to this
> email from Walter quite a few times - there's some great tips here.
>
> With paredit I am really only using three  things but its enough that I no
> longer have to keep switching it off to get me out of trouble.
>
> These are:
>
> C-right arrow
> C-left arrow
>
> Those two commands move the nearest paren (or square bracket, brace,
> double quote) either right or left one level.  I think the gurus call this
> "slurp" and "barf"?  But I'm not sure which is which off the top of my head
> :)
>
> The other one is M-s which deletes the surrounding parens (or other tokens
> as per above).  When I discovered this I was away.
>
> I'm sure there's much more to paredit but this has been enough to get me
> going.
>
> Andrew
>
> On 16/05/2013, at 8:05 AM, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>
> > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time.
> It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> >
> > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use
> it for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript
> and HTML editing work well too.
> >
> > ymmv
> >
> > -Walter
> >
> >
> > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
> >
> >> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> >>
> >> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> >>
> >> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
> every way … so how do you Clojure?
> >>
> >>
> >> - Phil
> >
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Charlie Griefer
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 22:25
On May 15, 2013, at 3:05 PM, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:

> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. 
It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. 
I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, 
but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was 
enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el. 


I'll second this. I was also told not to try and "learn" Emacs while 
learning a new language, and I didn't disagree with that.  But after a 
while I felt that writing Clojure in a more proper environment might help 
learn Clojure.

I'm not saying Emacs is better than Vim or Eclipse with Counterclockwise 
or Lighttable. But it does seem to be what most Lispers use. It's what 
we've agreed to standardize on at work, and it's really not as difficult 
to learn as most people might have you believe.

--
Charlie Griefer
http://charlie.griefer.com

"Give light, and the darkness will disappear of itself." 
-- Desiderius Erasmus

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:00
Hey Walter,

Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
cheatsheet?

I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
editor and a new language?
  I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).

With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:

;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
(define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
(define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)

I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
error on startup, and I have no idea why:

Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
`c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':

Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map

To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.

Any ideas?

Thanks!

Andrew.

On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. 
It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. 
I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, 
but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was 
enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>
> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.
>
> ymmv
>
> -Walter
>
>
> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>
>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>
>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>
>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in 
every way … so how do you Clojure?
>>
>>
>> - Phil
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:07
Okay true to my usual form I have found the answer almost immediately
after asking the question.

For the record:

;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
(eval-after-load "nrepl-mode"
  '(progn
     (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
     (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)))

I got my inspiration here:
https://github.com/magnars/.emacs.d/blob/master/setup-clojure-mode.el

On 16 May 2013 13:00, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Walter,
>
> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
> cheatsheet?
>
> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> editor and a new language?
>   I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>
> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
>
> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>
> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>
> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>
> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>
> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Andrew.
>
> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time.
It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. 
I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, 
but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was 
enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>>
>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.
>>
>> ymmv
>>
>> -Walter
>>
>>
>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>>
>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>>
>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>>
>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in 
every way … so how do you Clojure?
>>>
>>>
>>> - Phil
>>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:10
Actually no that doesn't work either.  It just prevents an error on startup :)

On 16 May 2013 13:07, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
> Okay true to my usual form I have found the answer almost immediately
> after asking the question.
>
> For the record:
>
> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> (eval-after-load "nrepl-mode"
>   '(progn
>      (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>      (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)))
>
> I got my inspiration here:
> https://github.com/magnars/.emacs.d/blob/master/setup-clojure-mode.el
>
> On 16 May 2013 13:00, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hey Walter,
>>
>> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
>> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
>> cheatsheet?
>>
>> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
>> editor and a new language?
>>   I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>>
>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
>>
>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>>
>> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>>
>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>>
>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>>
>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>>
>> Any ideas?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Andrew.
>>
>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same 
time. It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs 
users. I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts 
before, but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I 
edit was enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>>>
>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.
>>>
>>> ymmv
>>>
>>> -Walter
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>>>
>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>>>
>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at 
the moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>>>
>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in 
every way … so how do you Clojure?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - Phil
>>>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Walter Babic
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:25
Andrew,

For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at 
https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el

For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in 
shell mode.

I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I do 
plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time ...

-Walter



On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:

> Hey Walter,
> 
> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
> cheatsheet?
> 
> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> editor and a new language?
>  I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> 
> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
> 
> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> 
> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> 
> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> 
> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> 
> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Andrew.
> 
> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time.
It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. 
I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, 
but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was 
enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>> 
>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein 
project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will 
load that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back 
to Eclipse or IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my 
opinion, but it was not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs 
work together so well. Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode 
is also awesome. I use it for learning other languages like Haskell and 
Scala. Python, javascript and HTML editing work well too.
>> 
>> ymmv
>> 
>> -Walter
>> 
>> 
>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>> 
>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>> 
>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>> 
>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in 
every way … so how do you Clojure?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> - Phil
>> 

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:36
Thanks Walter.  M-p and M-n look good enough for me.

Thanks for that link also.

On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
> Andrew,
>
> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
>
> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
> shell mode.
>
> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I do
> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time ...
>
> -Walter
>
>
>
> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
>
> Hey Walter,
>
> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
> cheatsheet?
>
> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
>
> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> editor and a new language?
>  I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>
> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
>
> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>
> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
>
> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>
> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>
> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>
> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Andrew.
>
> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>
> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. It
> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>
>
> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use it
> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript and
> HTML editing work well too.
>
>
> ymmv
>
>
> -Walter
>
>
>
> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
>
>
> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>
>
> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>
>
> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every way
> … so how do you Clojure?
>
>
>
> - Phil
>
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
i-blis
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 11:36
Greetings to everyone.

I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and 
Sublime Text for more casual things.

As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for 
experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light 
Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good 
subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but 
for the vim users out there this could be less an issue.

The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in connecting to
lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode (with (basic) 
display of intermediary results within functions!). Very similar to Emacs 
Live in a way.  

I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.

i-blis.  


On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:

> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
>  
> Thanks for that link also.
>  
> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> > Andrew,
> >  
> > For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> > https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
> >  
> > For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
> > shell mode.
> >  
> > I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I do
> > plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time ...
> >  
> > -Walter
> >  
> >  
> >  
> > On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >  
> > Hey Walter,
> >  
> > Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> > the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
> > cheatsheet?
> >  
> > I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
> >  
> > perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> > editor and a new language?
> > I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> > disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> >  
> > With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> > arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
> > this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> > 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
> >  
> > ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> >  
> > I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
> >  
> > error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> >  
> > Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> > `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> >  
> > Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> >  
> > To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> > cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
> > the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> >  
> > Any ideas?
> >  
> > Thanks!
> >  
> > Andrew.
> >  
> > On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> >  
> > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. It
> > also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
> > decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
> > the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
> > inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> >  
> >  
> > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> > project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
> > that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
> > very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
> > IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
> > not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
> > Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use it
> > for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript and
> > HTML editing work well too.
> >  
> >  
> > ymmv
> >  
> >  
> > -Walter
> >  
> >  
> >  
> > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
> >  
> >  
> > What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> >  
> >  
> > I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> > moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> > vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> >  
> >  
> > Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every way
> > … so how do you Clojure?
> >  
> >  
> >  
> > - Phil  

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Mark Stang
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 12:58
I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
I do most of my Java development in Eclipse.  And on occasion I have used
Intellij.  So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in
Eclipse.  And it also seemed to be a dog.  Might have been my slow machine,
ymmv.

So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried that.
 It worked well enough with nailgun.  And it could reformat my Clojure code.
And the snytax highlighting was pretty good.  And I could move around.
 However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from
within vim.

So, I tried LightTable.  At first I couldn't get it to read my projects and
such.  Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single form.
However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some loop
and never come back.  I think it is fine for toy projects and I have high
hopes for it in the future.
However, I don't think it is quite there yet.

So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off.  At
first I had problems with "slime" and such.  I would go back and give it a
go and then give up.
Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable.  As others have said, emacs
understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure.  nRepl is easy
to start, kill and see results.
Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the running
nRepl.  And you can see immediate results executing a form in the messages
at the bottom of the screen.
Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all my
XML editing (except formatting).  I also use emacs for Git (magit).
In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers is
time consuming.  I would prefer tabs.  Also, I would prefer vim
key-bindings.
However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.

When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however,
after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now
it makes sense.
Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works.  Which is basically, a C
base with a lisp machine managing everything.
Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more
powerful.

Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it yet.
 It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.

So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best for
lisp.  It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.

regards,

Mark



On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:

> Greetings to everyone.
>
> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and
> Sublime Text for more casual things.
>
> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for
> experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light
> Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good
> subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
> to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but for
> the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
>
> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in connecting to
> lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode (with (basic)
> display of intermediary results within functions!). Very similar to Emacs
> Live in a way.
>
> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
>
> i-blis.
>
>
> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
>
> > Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
> >
> > Thanks for that link also.
> >
> > On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> > > Andrew,
> > >
> > > For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> > > https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
> > >
> > > For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
> > > shell mode.
> > >
> > > I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I
> do
> > > plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time
> ...
> > >
> > > -Walter
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> > >
> > > Hey Walter,
> > >
> > > Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> > > the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
> > > cheatsheet?
> > >
> > > I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
> > >
> > > perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> > > editor and a new language?
> > > I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> > > disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> > >
> > > With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> > > arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
> > > this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> > >
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
> :
> > >
> > > ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> > > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> > > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> > >
> > > I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
> > >
> > > error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> > >
> > > Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> > > `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> > >
> > > Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> > >
> > > To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> > > cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
> > > the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> > >
> > > Any ideas?
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Andrew.
> > >
> > > On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> > >
> > > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same
> time. It
> > > also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users.
> I
> > > decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before,
> but
> > > the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was
> enough
> > > inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> > >
> > >
> > > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> > > project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will
> load
> > > that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file.
> Paredit is
> > > very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to
> Eclipse or
> > > IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it
> was
> > > not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so
> well.
> > > Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I
> use it
> > > for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python,
> javascript and
> > > HTML editing work well too.
> > >
> > >
> > > ymmv
> > >
> > >
> > > -Walter
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
> > >
> > >
> > > What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> > >
> > >
> > > I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> > > moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> > > vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> > >
> > >
> > > Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
> every way
> > > … so how do you Clojure?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > - Phil
>
>
>

[foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
i-blis
Date:
2013-05-17 @ 11:49
Regarding LightTable.

You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (> 0.4) 
appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned from
Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code and 
learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue compiling 
and evaluate the code.

One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs 
sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more 
effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when 
I really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.

What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).

Just sharing my experience.

Best regards, i-blis.


On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:

> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have used
Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in 
Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine, 
ymmv.
>  
> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried 
that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my Clojure
code.
> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move around. 
However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from 
within vim.
>  
> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my projects 
and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single 
form.
> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some 
loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I have 
high hopes for it in the future.
> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
>  
> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. At 
first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it a 
go and then give up.
> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said, emacs 
understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl is easy
to start, kill and see results.
> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the 
running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the 
messages at the bottom of the screen.
> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all 
my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers is 
time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim 
key-bindings.
> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
>  
> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however, 
after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now 
it makes sense.
> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is basically, a
C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more powerful.
>  
> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it 
yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
>  
> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best for 
lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
>  
> regards,
>  
> Mark
>  
>  
>  
> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru 
(mailto:i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
> > Greetings to everyone.
> >  
> > I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and 
Sublime Text for more casual things.
> >  
> > As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for
experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light 
Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good 
subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but 
for the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
> >  
> > The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in 
connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode 
(with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very 
similar to Emacs Live in a way.
> >  
> > I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
> >  
> > i-blis.
> >  
> >  
> > On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >  
> > > Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
> > >  
> > > Thanks for that link also.
> > >  
> > > On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> > > > Andrew,
> > > >  
> > > > For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> > > > https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
> > > >  
> > > > For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
> > > > shell mode.
> > > >  
> > > > I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I do
> > > > plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time ...
> > > >  
> > > > -Walter
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> > > >  
> > > > Hey Walter,
> > > >  
> > > > Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> > > > the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
> > > > cheatsheet?
> > > >  
> > > > I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
> > > >  
> > > > perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> > > > editor and a new language?
> > > > I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> > > > disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> > > >  
> > > > With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> > > > arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
> > > > this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> > > > 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
> > > >  
> > > > ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> > > > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> > > > (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> > > >  
> > > > I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
> > > >  
> > > > error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> > > >  
> > > > Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> > > > `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> > > >  
> > > > Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> > > >  
> > > > To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> > > > cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
> > > > the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> > > >  
> > > > Any ideas?
> > > >  
> > > > Thanks!
> > > >  
> > > > Andrew.
> > > >  
> > > > On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> > > >  
> > > > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. It
> > > > also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
> > > > decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
> > > > the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
> > > > inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> > > > project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file 
will load
> > > > that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
> > > > very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to 
Eclipse or
> > > > IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
> > > > not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
> > > > Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also 
awesome. I use it
> > > > for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, 
javascript and
> > > > HTML editing work well too.
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > ymmv
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > -Walter
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> > > > moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> > > > vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
every way
> > > > … so how do you Clojure?
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > - Phil  

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-17 @ 12:15
At Lambda Jam when Stuart Sierra was showing us Datomic he seemed to have 
a command in emacs that pasted the current expression into the nrepl 
window.  When I use C-c C-e it evaluates it but doesn't actually copy the 
code into the nrepl window.

Does anyone know how to do this?  I should have asked him I guess!

Andrew

On 17/05/2013, at 9:49 PM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:

> Regarding LightTable.
> 
> You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (> 0.4)
appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned from
Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code and 
learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue compiling 
and evaluate the code.
> 
> One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs 
sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more 
effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when 
I really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.
> 
> What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).
> 
> Just sharing my experience.
> 
> Best regards, i-blis.
> 
> 
> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:
> 
>> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
>> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have 
used Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
>> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in 
Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine, 
ymmv.
>> 
>> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried 
that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my Clojure
code.
>> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move around. 
However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
>> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from 
within vim.
>> 
>> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my projects 
and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single 
form.
>> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some 
loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I have 
high hopes for it in the future.
>> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
>> 
>> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. At 
first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it a 
go and then give up.
>> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said, emacs
understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl is easy
to start, kill and see results.
>> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the 
running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the 
messages at the bottom of the screen.
>> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all 
my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
>> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers is
time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim 
key-bindings.
>> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
>> 
>> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however, 
after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now 
it makes sense.
>> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is basically, 
a C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
>> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more powerful.
>> 
>> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it 
yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
>> 
>> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best for
lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
>> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
>> 
>> regards,
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru 
(mailto:i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
>>> Greetings to everyone.
>>> 
>>> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and 
Sublime Text for more casual things.
>>> 
>>> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for
experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light 
Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good 
subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but 
for the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
>>> 
>>> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in 
connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode 
(with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very 
similar to Emacs Live in a way.
>>> 
>>> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
>>> 
>>> i-blis.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks for that link also.
>>>> 
>>>> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>>>>> Andrew,
>>>>> 
>>>>> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
>>>>> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
>>>>> 
>>>>> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
>>>>> shell mode.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master. I do
>>>>> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a time ...
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Walter
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hey Walter,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
>>>>> the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
>>>>> cheatsheet?
>>>>> 
>>>>> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
>>>>> 
>>>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
>>>>> editor and a new language?
>>>>> I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>>>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>>>>> 
>>>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>>>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
>>>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>>>>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>>>>> 
>>>>> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
>>>>> 
>>>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>>>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>>>>> 
>>>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>>>>> 
>>>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>>>>> cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
>>>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Any ideas?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>> 
>>>>> Andrew.
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time. It
>>>>> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
>>>>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
>>>>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
>>>>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
>>>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
>>>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
>>>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
>>>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
>>>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
>>>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use it
>>>>> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript and
>>>>> HTML editing work well too.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ymmv
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Walter
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
>>>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>>>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every way
>>>>> … so how do you Clojure?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Phil  
> 
> 

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Mark Stang
Date:
2013-05-17 @ 12:37
I always do it manually.  Do you follow him on twitter?  I would post a
question there.
If you are not, I am and I could ask.

regards,

Mark


On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:15 AM, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:

> At Lambda Jam when Stuart Sierra was showing us Datomic he seemed to have
> a command in emacs that pasted the current expression into the nrepl
> window.  When I use C-c C-e it evaluates it but doesn't actually copy the
> code into the nrepl window.
>
> Does anyone know how to do this?  I should have asked him I guess!
>
> Andrew
>
> On 17/05/2013, at 9:49 PM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:
>
> > Regarding LightTable.
> >
> > You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (> 0.4)
> appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned from
> Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code and
> learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue compiling and
> evaluate the code.
> >
> > One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs
> sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more
> effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
> source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when I
> really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.
> >
> > What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).
> >
> > Just sharing my experience.
> >
> > Best regards, i-blis.
> >
> >
> > On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:
> >
> >> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
> >> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have
> used Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
> >> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in
> Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine,
> ymmv.
> >>
> >> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried
> that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my Clojure
> code.
> >> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move around.
> However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
> >> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from
> within vim.
> >>
> >> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my projects
> and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single
> form.
> >> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some
> loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I have
> high hopes for it in the future.
> >> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
> >>
> >> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. At
> first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it a
> go and then give up.
> >> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said, emacs
> understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl is easy
> to start, kill and see results.
> >> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the
> running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the
> messages at the bottom of the screen.
> >> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all
> my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
> >> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers is
> time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim key-bindings.
> >> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
> >>
> >> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however,
> after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now
> it makes sense.
> >> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is basically,
> a C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
> >> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more
> powerful.
> >>
> >> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it
> yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
> >>
> >> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best for
> lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
> >> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
> >>
> >> regards,
> >>
> >> Mark
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru (mailto:
> i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
> >>> Greetings to everyone.
> >>>
> >>> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and
> Sublime Text for more casual things.
> >>>
> >>> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical for
> experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light
> Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good
> subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
> to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but for
> the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
> >>>
> >>> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in
> connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode
> (with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very
> similar to Emacs Live in a way.
> >>>
> >>> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
> >>>
> >>> i-blis.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks for that link also.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> >>>>> Andrew,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
> >>>>> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while
> in
> >>>>> shell mode.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a master.
> I do
> >>>>> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a
> time ...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Walter
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hey Walter,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> >>>>> the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
> >>>>> cheatsheet?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
> >>>>>
> >>>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both
> the
> >>>>> editor and a new language?
> >>>>> I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> >>>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> >>>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
> >>>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
> >>>>>
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
> :
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
> >>>>>
> >>>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> >>>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> >>>>> cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
> >>>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Any ideas?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Andrew.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same
> time. It
> >>>>> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs
> users. I
> >>>>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts
> before, but
> >>>>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was
> enough
> >>>>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> >>>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file
> will load
> >>>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file.
> Paredit is
> >>>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to
> Eclipse or
> >>>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but
> it was
> >>>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so
> well.
> >>>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome.
> I use it
> >>>>> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python,
> javascript and
> >>>>> HTML editing work well too.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ymmv
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -Walter
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at
> the
> >>>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> >>>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
> every way
> >>>>> … so how do you Clojure?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> - Phil
> >
> >
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Mark Stang
Date:
2013-05-17 @ 21:54
All,
Just saw this:


http://ianeslick.com/2013/05/17/clojure-debugging-13-emacs-nrepl-and-ritz/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Looks interesting, but will require a bit of time to merge it with my
current emacs environment.

regards,

Mark


On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:37 AM, Mark Stang <markjstang@gmail.com> wrote:

> I always do it manually.  Do you follow him on twitter?  I would post a
> question there.
> If you are not, I am and I could ask.
>
> regards,
>
> Mark
>
>
> On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:15 AM, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> At Lambda Jam when Stuart Sierra was showing us Datomic he seemed to have
>> a command in emacs that pasted the current expression into the nrepl
>> window.  When I use C-c C-e it evaluates it but doesn't actually copy the
>> code into the nrepl window.
>>
>> Does anyone know how to do this?  I should have asked him I guess!
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>> On 17/05/2013, at 9:49 PM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:
>>
>> > Regarding LightTable.
>> >
>> > You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (>
>> 0.4) appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned
>> from Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code
>> and learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue compiling
>> and evaluate the code.
>> >
>> > One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs
>> sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more
>> effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
>> source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when I
>> really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.
>> >
>> > What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).
>> >
>> > Just sharing my experience.
>> >
>> > Best regards, i-blis.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:
>> >
>> >> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
>> >> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have
>> used Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
>> >> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in
>> Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine,
>> ymmv.
>> >>
>> >> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and tried
>> that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my Clojure
>> code.
>> >> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move around.
>> However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
>> >> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form from
>> within vim.
>> >>
>> >> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my projects
>> and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute a single
>> form.
>> >> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into some
>> loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I have
>> high hopes for it in the future.
>> >> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
>> >>
>> >> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. At
>> first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it a
>> go and then give up.
>> >> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said,
>> emacs understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl is
>> easy to start, kill and see results.
>> >> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the
>> running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the
>> messages at the bottom of the screen.
>> >> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for all
>> my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
>> >> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between buffers
>> is time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim
>> key-bindings.
>> >> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
>> >>
>> >> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, however,
>> after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier and now
>> it makes sense.
>> >> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is basically,
>> a C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
>> >> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it more
>> powerful.
>> >>
>> >> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with it
>> yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
>> >>
>> >> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best
>> for lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
>> >> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
>> >>
>> >> regards,
>> >>
>> >> Mark
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru (mailto:
>> i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
>> >>> Greetings to everyone.
>> >>>
>> >>> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing and
>> Sublime Text for more casual things.
>> >>>
>> >>> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical
>> for experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light
>> Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good
>> subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
>> to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but for
>> the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in
>> connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode
>> (with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very
>> similar to Emacs Live in a way.
>> >>>
>> >>> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
>> >>>
>> >>> i-blis.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thanks for that link also.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
>> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>> >>>>> Andrew,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
>> >>>>> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works
>> while in
>> >>>>> shell mode.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a
>> master. I do
>> >>>>> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a
>> time ...
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> -Walter
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Hey Walter,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands
>> is
>> >>>>> the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
>> >>>>> cheatsheet?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both
>> the
>> >>>>> editor and a new language?
>> >>>>> I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>> >>>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>> >>>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
>> >>>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O
>> question
>> >>>>>
>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
>> :
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>> >>>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>> >>>>> cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
>> >>>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Any ideas?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Thanks!
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Andrew.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com (mailto:
>> wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same
>> time. It
>> >>>>> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs
>> users. I
>> >>>>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts
>> before, but
>> >>>>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was
>> enough
>> >>>>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
>> >>>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file
>> will load
>> >>>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file.
>> Paredit is
>> >>>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to
>> Eclipse or
>> >>>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but
>> it was
>> >>>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together
>> so well.
>> >>>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome.
>> I use it
>> >>>>> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python,
>> javascript and
>> >>>>> HTML editing work well too.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> ymmv
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> -Walter
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at
>> the
>> >>>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>> >>>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
>> every way
>> >>>>> … so how do you Clojure?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> - Phil
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Andrew Myers
Date:
2013-05-17 @ 22:30
I pinged Stuart with my question on twitter.  Hopefully he will share his 
secret :)

Andrew

On 18/05/2013, at 7:54 AM, Mark Stang <markjstang@gmail.com> wrote:

> All,
> Just saw this:
> 
> 
http://ianeslick.com/2013/05/17/clojure-debugging-13-emacs-nrepl-and-ritz/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
> 
> Looks interesting, but will require a bit of time to merge it with my 
current emacs environment.
> 
> regards,
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:37 AM, Mark Stang <markjstang@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I always do it manually.  Do you follow him on twitter?  I would post a
question there.
>> If you are not, I am and I could ask.
>> 
>> regards,
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> 
>> On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 6:15 AM, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> At Lambda Jam when Stuart Sierra was showing us Datomic he seemed to 
have a command in emacs that pasted the current expression into the nrepl 
window.  When I use C-c C-e it evaluates it but doesn't actually copy the 
code into the nrepl window.
>>> 
>>> Does anyone know how to do this?  I should have asked him I guess!
>>> 
>>> Andrew
>>> 
>>> On 17/05/2013, at 9:49 PM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru> wrote:
>>> 
>>> > Regarding LightTable.
>>> >
>>> > You're right it is not quite there yet. Still, the last releases (> 
0.4) appear to be pretty stable. I loaded mid-size Clojure projects cloned
from Github (aleph and lamina, for instance) to play with the source code 
and learn how things are done in Clojure. LightTable had no issue 
compiling and evaluate the code.
>>> >
>>> > One point though: the live eval (that they call "instarepl") hangs 
sometimes and in some case for not so obvious reasons. I thus found more 
effective to tinker with the code with the non-live evaluation mode in the
source files themselves and do live repl requires in an extra window when 
I really wanted to see the effects of my hacking live on the fly.
>>> >
>>> > What I miss the most is good editing capabilities (emacs paredit).
>>> >
>>> > Just sharing my experience.
>>> >
>>> > Best regards, i-blis.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 14:58, Mark Stang wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> I seem to always be in search of the perfect Clojure IDE.
>>> >> I do most of my Java development in Eclipse. And on occasion I have
used Intellij. So, I tried both of their plugins for Clojure.
>>> >> However, I saw people doing things with emacs that I couldn't do in
Eclipse. And it also seemed to be a dog. Might have been my slow machine, 
ymmv.
>>> >>
>>> >> So, being a long time vim user, I installed the VimClojure and 
tried that. It worked well enough with nailgun. And it could reformat my 
Clojure code.
>>> >> And the snytax highlighting was pretty good. And I could move 
around. However, vim is line-oriented and lisp is not.
>>> >> In addition, I couldn't figure out how to evaluate a single form 
from within vim.
>>> >>
>>> >> So, I tried LightTable. At first I couldn't get it to read my 
projects and such. Eventually, I was able to load my projects and execute 
a single form.
>>> >> However, when I tried to load a large project, it would go into 
some loop and never come back. I think it is fine for toy projects and I 
have high hopes for it in the future.
>>> >> However, I don't think it is quite there yet.
>>> >>
>>> >> So, over the last couple of years, I have tried emacs, on and off. 
At first I had problems with "slime" and such. I would go back and give it
a go and then give up.
>>> >> Eventually, nRepl came out and it is stable. As others have said, 
emacs understands lisp and it does a pretty good job with Clojure. nRepl 
is easy to start, kill and see results.
>>> >> Also, I can evaluate a single form or the entire namespace with the
running nRepl. And you can see immediate results executing a form in the 
messages at the bottom of the screen.
>>> >> Eclipse has issues with XML files so I switched to using emacs for 
all my XML editing (except formatting). I also use emacs for Git (magit).
>>> >> In general emacs feels a little clunky and switching between 
buffers is time consuming. I would prefer tabs. Also, I would prefer vim 
key-bindings.
>>> >> However, I have stayed "native" so that I can learn it.
>>> >>
>>> >> When I first tried to configure emacs, I was hopelessly lost, 
however, after starting to learn Clojure and Scheme, I find it much easier
and now it makes sense.
>>> >> Some of the awe is gone from knowing how it works. Which is 
basically, a C base with a lisp machine managing everything.
>>> >> Major and Minor modes make it harder to understand, but makes it 
more powerful.
>>> >>
>>> >> Someone mentioned "clooj" but I haven't had a chance to play with 
it yet. It is written in Clojure, but is fairly new.
>>> >>
>>> >> So far, of all the editors I have tried, emacs seems to be the best
for lisp. It has a longer learning curve than some of the others.
>>> >> And eventually, I have high hopes for LightTable.
>>> >>
>>> >> regards,
>>> >>
>>> >> Mark
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 5:36 AM, i-blis <i-blis@yandex.ru 
(mailto:i-blis@yandex.ru)> wrote:
>>> >>> Greetings to everyone.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I normally use a mix of Emacs for complex tasks and heavy editing 
and Sublime Text for more casual things.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> As I started with Clojure I found Light Table to be very practical
for experiments. And I make now most of my forays into Clojure with Light 
Table. It is a little light on the editing side though, despite a good 
subset of vim bindings (from Codemirror) — the point is that I am not used
to vim and default bindings don't play well with a non US keyboard, but 
for the vim users out there this could be less an issue.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The good thing about Light Table for me is 1) flexibility in 
connecting to lein projects 2) inline results, 3) live evaluation mode 
(with (basic) display of intermediary results within functions!). Very 
similar to Emacs Live in a way.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I thought it'd be worth mentioning here.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> i-blis.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Thursday, 16 May 2013 at 5:36, Andrew Myers wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>>> Thanks Walter. M-p and M-n look good enough for me.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Thanks for that link also.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On 16 May 2013 13:25, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>>> >>>>> Andrew,
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> For nrepl.el, there is a nice summary of the commands I mentioned at
>>> >>>>> https://github.com/kingtim/nrepl.el
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> For navigating history I just use M-p and M-n which also works while in
>>> >>>>> shell mode.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I have Emacs working well with nrepl but am far from being a 
master. I do
>>> >>>>> plan on getting more into elisp when time permits. One step at a
time ...
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> -Walter
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Andrew Myers wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Hey Walter,
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Thanks for that overview. Sometimes I think finding these commands is
>>> >>>>> the hardest bit about Emacs. Perhaps we could as a group create a
>>> >>>>> cheatsheet?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I start ed using emacs just for general text editing a while ago. So
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
>>> >>>>> editor and a new language?
>>> >>>>> I'm now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>>> >>>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>>> >>>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands. I had found
>>> >>>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>>> >>>>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>>> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>>> >>>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I *think* it did work at some stage b ut with now it's giving this
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>>> >>>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>>> >>>>> cause of the error in your initialization file. Start Emacs with
>>> >>>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Any ideas?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Thanks!
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Andrew.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com 
(mailto:wbabic@mac.com) (mailto:wbabic@mac.com)> wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the 
same time. It
>>> >>>>> also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
>>> >>>>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts 
before, but
>>> >>>>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit 
was enough
>>> >>>>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
>>> >>>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source 
file will load
>>> >>>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. 
Paredit is
>>> >>>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to
Eclipse or
>>> >>>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, 
but it was
>>> >>>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work 
together so well.
>>> >>>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also 
awesome. I use it
>>> >>>>> for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, 
javascript and
>>> >>>>> HTML editing work well too.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> ymmv
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> -Walter
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen w rote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
>>> >>>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>>> >>>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices 
in every way
>>> >>>>> … so how do you Clojure?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> - Phil
>>> >
>>> >
> 

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
David Mitchell
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:12
Currently Sublime Text and vim, depending on my mood...

I've had it planned to switch to Emacs for most/all editing this year, and
I'll switch to it as soon as I have the brain space required to do so.  I
currently develop in C, Python, Erlang and now Clojure, so getting my head
around all the various add-ons isn't a trivial task.

One thing I've observed is that most of the good coders *I know personally*
use either vim/gvim or Eclipse (or Visual Studio if absolutely necessary),
but most of the *outstanding* programmers *I know personally* use Emacs for
everything and recommend it highly.  I'm very comfortable with vim, but
that's enough to convince me to give Emacs a serious try


On 16 May 2013 13:00, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey Walter,
>
> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
> cheatsheet?
>
> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
> editor and a new language?
>   I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>
> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>
> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
> :
>
> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>
> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>
> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>
> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>
> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Andrew.
>
> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
> > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time.
> It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
> >
> > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use
> it for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript
> and HTML editing work well too.
> >
> > ymmv
> >
> > -Walter
> >
> >
> > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
> >
> >> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> >>
> >> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> >>
> >> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
> every way … so how do you Clojure?
> >>
> >>
> >> - Phil
> >
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Stephen Johnston
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:22
I was an emacs user several years ago, but eventually switched to eclipse
for java development.
Emacs is awesome though, and I'm enjoying getting back into it.    I had
never learned elisp (or any lisp) before clojure.   One thing that's been
great about learning a lisp dialect:  it's making the elisp a lot easier to
read, understand, and write!  Imagine an editor with the power of lisp at
your disposal :-)  The latest emacs 24.1 has a package installer for elisp
packages which is pretty cool too.

If you want a nice emacs setup without having to do lots of customizations,
you can try "Emacs Live" distribution with lots of goodies for editing
clojure. (https://github.com/overtone/emacs-live).   It has many features,
like syntax highlighting, paredit, nrepl, auto-complete, etc, all out of
the box.

One final thought: I also think that counter-clockwise in eclipse is quite
nice.




On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:12 PM, David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com>wrote:

> Currently Sublime Text and vim, depending on my mood...
>
> I've had it planned to switch to Emacs for most/all editing this year, and
> I'll switch to it as soon as I have the brain space required to do so.  I
> currently develop in C, Python, Erlang and now Clojure, so getting my head
> around all the various add-ons isn't a trivial task.
>
> One thing I've observed is that most of the good coders *I know
> personally* use either vim/gvim or Eclipse (or Visual Studio if absolutely
> necessary), but most of the *outstanding* programmers *I know personally*
> use Emacs for everything and recommend it highly.  I'm very comfortable
> with vim, but that's enough to convince me to give Emacs a serious try
>
>
> On 16 May 2013 13:00, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hey Walter,
>>
>> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
>> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
>> cheatsheet?
>>
>> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
>> editor and a new language?
>>   I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>>
>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>>
>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
>> :
>>
>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>>
>> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>>
>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>>
>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>>
>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>>
>> Any ideas?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Andrew.
>>
>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>> > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same time.
>> It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs users. I
>> decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts before, but
>> the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit was enough
>> inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>> >
>> > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use
>> it for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript
>> and HTML editing work well too.
>> >
>> > ymmv
>> >
>> > -Walter
>> >
>> >
>> > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>> >
>> >> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>> >>
>> >> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>> >>
>> >> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
>> every way … so how do you Clojure?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> - Phil
>> >
>>
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Chalmers
Date:
2013-05-16 @ 03:25
Oh good point on the 'emacs-live' tip Stephen, I've not used it but it
reminded me that I should mention that I used the emacs starter kit (
https://github.com/technomancy/emacs-starter-kit) that really helped me get
off the ground with Emacs.


On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Stephen Johnston <
stephen.j.johnston@gmail.com> wrote:

> I was an emacs user several years ago, but eventually switched to eclipse
> for java development.
> Emacs is awesome though, and I'm enjoying getting back into it.    I had
> never learned elisp (or any lisp) before clojure.   One thing that's been
> great about learning a lisp dialect:  it's making the elisp a lot easier to
> read, understand, and write!  Imagine an editor with the power of lisp at
> your disposal :-)  The latest emacs 24.1 has a package installer for elisp
> packages which is pretty cool too.
>
> If you want a nice emacs setup without having to do lots of
> customizations, you can try "Emacs Live" distribution with lots of goodies
> for editing clojure. (https://github.com/overtone/emacs-live).   It has
> many features, like syntax highlighting, paredit, nrepl, auto-complete,
> etc, all out of the box.
>
> One final thought: I also think that counter-clockwise in eclipse is quite
> nice.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:12 PM, David Mitchell <monch1962@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Currently Sublime Text and vim, depending on my mood...
>>
>> I've had it planned to switch to Emacs for most/all editing this year,
>> and I'll switch to it as soon as I have the brain space required to do so.
>>  I currently develop in C, Python, Erlang and now Clojure, so getting my
>> head around all the various add-ons isn't a trivial task.
>>
>> One thing I've observed is that most of the good coders *I know
>> personally* use either vim/gvim or Eclipse (or Visual Studio if absolutely
>> necessary), but most of the *outstanding* programmers *I know
>> personally* use Emacs for everything and recommend it highly.  I'm very
>> comfortable with vim, but that's enough to convince me to give Emacs a
>> serious try
>>
>>
>> On 16 May 2013 13:00, Andrew Myers <am2605@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Walter,
>>>
>>> Thanks for that overview.  Sometimes I think finding these commands is
>>> the hardest bit about Emacs.  Perhaps we could as a group create a
>>> cheatsheet?
>>>
>>> I started using emacs just for general text editing a while ago.  So
>>> perhaps that's one way to get started, so you're not learning both the
>>> editor and a new language?
>>>   I'm  now fairly familiar with it (not paredit though - I have to
>>> disable that regularly in Clojure becuase I get stuck :)).
>>>
>>> With regards to nrepl inside emacs, I wanted to have my up and down
>>> arrow keys to allow me to scroll through past commands.  I had found
>>> this and put it in my init.el some time ago, as per this S/O question
>>>
>>> 
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15128418/is-there-a-way-to-do-a-history-search-in-nrepl
>>> :
>>>
>>> ;; enable up and down arrow keys to search history in nrepl mode
>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<up>") 'nrepl-previous-input)
>>> (define-key nrepl-mode-map (kbd "<down>") 'nrepl-next-input)
>>>
>>> I *think* it did work at some stage but with now it's giving this
>>> error on startup, and I have no idea why:
>>>
>>> Warning (initialization): An error occurred while loading
>>> `c:/Users/amyers/.emacs.d/init.el':
>>>
>>> Symbol's value as variable is void: nrepl-mode-map
>>>
>>> To ensure normal operation, you should investigate and remove the
>>> cause of the error in your initialization file.  Start Emacs with
>>> the `--debug-init' option to view a complete error backtrace.
>>>
>>> Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Andrew.
>>>
>>> On 16 May 2013 08:05, Walter Babic <wbabic@mac.com> wrote:
>>> > They say not to learn a new editor and a new language at the same
>>> time. It also seemed to me that much of the Clojure community were Emacs
>>> users. I decided to go ahead and learn Emacs. I had made a few attempts
>>> before, but the idea of using the REPL in the same environment where I edit
>>> was enough inspiration. I now use Emacs with paredit and nrepl.el.
>>> >
>>> > M-x nrepl-jack-in will open a REPL with classpath loaded from a lein
>>> project.clj file in current directory. C-c C-k from a source file will load
>>> that file and C-c M-n will switch to the namespace of the file. Paredit is
>>> very nice once I got used to it. I can not imagine going back to Eclipse or
>>> IntelliJ now. It was a detour and well worth it in my opinion, but it was
>>> not necessary to just learn Clojure. Lisp and Emacs work together so well.
>>> Emacs also works well with the shell, and org-mode is also awesome. I use
>>> it for learning other languages like Haskell and Scala. Python, javascript
>>> and HTML editing work well too.
>>> >
>>> > ymmv
>>> >
>>> > -Walter
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On May 15, 2013, at 2:48 PM, Phil Cohen wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>> >>
>>> >> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at
>>> the moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>> >>
>>> >> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in
>>> every way … so how do you Clojure?
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> - Phil
>>> >
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Charlie Griefer
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 20:52
On May 15, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:

> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
> 
> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the 
moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying 
vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
> 
> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
way … so how do you Clojure?

I started off using Sublime Text 2, as that's what I was using for my 
previous language (CFML). Eventually, moved to Emacs. I expected it to be 
much more difficult of a transition than it was. Psyched myself out. Sat 
there for a few nights doing the built-in tutorials, and told myself I'd 
switch over to it when I "felt ready". Eventually I realized it's like 
having kids. Don't wait until you feel ready. You'll never feel ready. 
Just do it.

Felt awkward for a couple of days. Not even a week. I had a cheat sheet 
open on my laptop while I worked on the desktop. Eventually found that I 
had to refer to the cheat sheet much less frequently.

Really enjoying Emacs now for Clojure development.

Paredit mode… that's another story entirely :D

--
Charlie Griefer
http://charlie.griefer.com

"Give light, and the darkness will disappear of itself." 
-- Desiderius Erasmus

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Ricardo Mendes
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 22:00
I'm actually using Light Table for my Clojurings.
I thought about learning Emacs for a more "native" experience, but as an
occasional vim user I couldn't justify the effort, and LT is shaping up
incredibly well.


On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Charlie Griefer <charlie@griefer.com>wrote:

> On May 15, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:
>
> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>
> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>
> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
> way … so how do you Clojure?
>
>
> I started off using Sublime Text 2, as that's what I was using for my
> previous language (CFML). Eventually, moved to Emacs. I expected it to be
> much more difficult of a transition than it was. Psyched myself out. Sat
> there for a few nights doing the built-in tutorials, and told myself I'd
> switch over to it when I "felt ready". Eventually I realized it's like
> having kids. Don't wait until you feel ready. You'll never feel ready. Just
> do it.
>
> Felt awkward for a couple of days. Not even a week. I had a cheat sheet
> open on my laptop while I worked on the desktop. Eventually found that I
> had to refer to the cheat sheet much less frequently.
>
> Really enjoying Emacs now for Clojure development.
>
> Paredit mode… that's another story entirely :D
>
>  --
> Charlie Griefer
> <http://charlie.griefer.com>http://charlie.griefer.com
>
> "Give light, and the darkness will disappear of itself."
> -- Desiderius Erasmus
>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Sean Chalmers
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 22:03
I use Emacs primarily, I really really really really want to use LightTable
but I haven't been able to get used to it yet and I've become so used to
the paredit/indentation system in Emacs it's really hard to move. :(

I should probably just try to write a plugin for it when I'm better at this
delicious Lisp-ness. :P


On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 8:00 AM, Ricardo Mendes <rokusu@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm actually using Light Table for my Clojurings.
> I thought about learning Emacs for a more "native" experience, but as an
> occasional vim user I couldn't justify the effort, and LT is shaping up
> incredibly well.
>
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Charlie Griefer <charlie@griefer.com>wrote:
>
>> On May 15, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:
>>
>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>
>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>
>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
>> way … so how do you Clojure?
>>
>>
>> I started off using Sublime Text 2, as that's what I was using for my
>> previous language (CFML). Eventually, moved to Emacs. I expected it to be
>> much more difficult of a transition than it was. Psyched myself out. Sat
>> there for a few nights doing the built-in tutorials, and told myself I'd
>> switch over to it when I "felt ready". Eventually I realized it's like
>> having kids. Don't wait until you feel ready. You'll never feel ready. Just
>> do it.
>>
>> Felt awkward for a couple of days. Not even a week. I had a cheat sheet
>> open on my laptop while I worked on the desktop. Eventually found that I
>> had to refer to the cheat sheet much less frequently.
>>
>> Really enjoying Emacs now for Clojure development.
>>
>> Paredit mode… that's another story entirely :D
>>
>>  --
>> Charlie Griefer
>> <http://charlie.griefer.com>http://charlie.griefer.com
>>
>> "Give light, and the darkness will disappear of itself."
>> -- Desiderius Erasmus
>>
>>
>

Re: [foray] Editors / IDEs

From:
Mark Stang
Date:
2013-05-15 @ 22:06
Emacs and nRepl
On May 15, 2013 4:03 PM, "Sean Chalmers" <sclhiannan@gmail.com> wrote:

> I use Emacs primarily, I really really really really want to use
> LightTable but I haven't been able to get used to it yet and I've become so
> used to the paredit/indentation system in Emacs it's really hard to move.
> :(
>
> I should probably just try to write a plugin for it when I'm better at
> this delicious Lisp-ness. :P
>
>
> On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 8:00 AM, Ricardo Mendes <rokusu@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm actually using Light Table for my Clojurings.
>> I thought about learning Emacs for a more "native" experience, but as an
>> occasional vim user I couldn't justify the effort, and LT is shaping up
>> incredibly well.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Charlie Griefer <charlie@griefer.com>wrote:
>>
>>> On May 15, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Phil Cohen <phil@wpw.so> wrote:
>>>
>>> What editor and/or IDE environments are people using?
>>>
>>> I spend most of my time in vim and I have been using VimClojure at the
>>> moment for basic support, but I have been looking at trying
>>> vim-clojure-static and vim-fireplace.
>>>
>>> Obviously Emacs/IntelliJ/$OTHER_EDITOR are far superior choices in every
>>> way … so how do you Clojure?
>>>
>>>
>>> I started off using Sublime Text 2, as that's what I was using for my
>>> previous language (CFML). Eventually, moved to Emacs. I expected it to be
>>> much more difficult of a transition than it was. Psyched myself out. Sat
>>> there for a few nights doing the built-in tutorials, and told myself I'd
>>> switch over to it when I "felt ready". Eventually I realized it's like
>>> having kids. Don't wait until you feel ready. You'll never feel ready. Just
>>> do it.
>>>
>>> Felt awkward for a couple of days. Not even a week. I had a cheat sheet
>>> open on my laptop while I worked on the desktop. Eventually found that I
>>> had to refer to the cheat sheet much less frequently.
>>>
>>> Really enjoying Emacs now for Clojure development.
>>>
>>> Paredit mode… that's another story entirely :D
>>>
>>>  --
>>> Charlie Griefer
>>> <http://charlie.griefer.com>http://charlie.griefer.com
>>>
>>> "Give light, and the darkness will disappear of itself."
>>> -- Desiderius Erasmus
>>>
>>>
>>
>